Clay Pots - Reef-Geeks

Jcling · Reef-Geek

Question for everyone. Everyone please chime in if you have info that might help.

Scenario:
Broke a clay pot and put two pieces (one in each of my tanks with anemones near them) for my clowns to have a nice flat spot to lay their eggs.

Problem:
Both my LTA which has been doing well for over a year looks like ****... (there is a video of it going downhill yesterday) and my nice new carpet doesn't look much better.

I took both pieces out and it looks like the LTA is already looking happy again.

So... my question is what is in a clay pot that created this negative reaction in my anemones. I cant imagine copper, and i know there are silicates that are used to make the pots, could this create a problem?

Any input will help!

Thanks everyone

~Jared

chris&barb · Lost

I would add some carbon also to remove anything else that may be causing this.

Give me a sec to look at clay pots and what they are made from

Jcling · Reef-Geek

I'm pretty sure it was the clay because this happened to two separate anemones in two different tanks shortly after the clay pot was introduced in each tank.

Thank you for looking into it for me

chris&barb · Lost

Holly smokes! Clay is not easly defined

"Clay is a naturally occurring material composed primarily of fine-grained minerals, which show plasticity through a variable range of water content, and which can be hardened when dried and/or fired. Clay deposits are mostly composed of clay minerals (phyllosilicate minerals), minerals which impart plasticity and harden when fired and/or dried, and variable amounts of water trapped in the mineral structure by polar attraction. Organic materials which do not impart plasticity may also be a part of clay deposits."

From the sounds of this it could be pretty much anything.

chris&barb · Lost

Holly smokes! Clay is not easly defined

"Clay is a naturally occurring material composed primarily of fine-grained minerals, which show plasticity through a variable range of water content, and which can be hardened when dried and/or fired. Clay deposits are mostly composed of clay minerals (phyllosilicate minerals), minerals which impart plasticity and harden when fired and/or dried, and variable amounts of water trapped in the mineral structure by polar attraction. Organic materials which do not impart plasticity may also be a part of clay deposits."

From the sounds of this it could be pretty much anything.

Jcling · Reef-Geek

Ya that's basically the definition that I found... and it didn't really say anything about what it is lol... Guess I got a bad clay pot? lol

chris&barb · Lost

I guess you could have. Ive never been a fan of clay pots for clowns anyway but so many people use them.

How long have the pots been out now and how are the nems looking?

Jcling · Reef-Geek

took both out yesterday and the anemones are decent at best... Hopefully all will improve b/c they are nice anemones, but I'm not too worried. They will bounce back

LTA is already starting to lose the bad ends and disc is starting to fill back in nicely

And momma is starting to eat again which means her home is doing better lol.

chris&barb · Lost

Thats great they are doing better. I wish i could be more help but from what ive found clay could be pretty much anything

Jcling · Reef-Geek

No i understand, I wasn't able to find any more than you did... thats why I was so confused. Clay has a very... broad composition i guess lol

Barbara · Geekette

while I don't know much more than what was already stated about clay...I do know to listen to my livestock! If both nems reacted negatively as soon as the clay was introduced in two different tanks...and they're both now doing good again since you took the clay out...I for one would NOT use clay in those tanks!

what about adding a ceramic tile in each tank? we added a tile to our 30g with the saddles since we didn't really have a spot on the rocks for them and they took to it immediately with no negative impact on the carpet...just a thought!

this is an interesting issue that you raised Jared....most people I know who use clay pots are using them in breeding tanks...tanks that do not include corals, inverts or anemones...I wonder if the clay is fine for fish but not for other livestock??? hmmmmmm...very interesting indeed

spinycheek · Insert Custom Title Here

I believe clay also has the ability to bind to (and potentially re-release) many types of heavy metals and toxins, hence why it's so popular for lining toxic waste dumps. You probably just a got a bad pot.

Jcling · Reef-Geek

I'll have to try the ceramic tiles at some point

I'm thinking the same thing about the clay pots but I'm a fan of keeping my clowns in as natural an environment as i can

high tide · Big-Geek

If they are the normal terracotta pots just bare in mind they are probably the most produced item of all time, they put stuff in the mix thats hard to imagine and pronounce lol, its a low fired clay ie low heat, much of the additives are still open and somewhat soluble, here is a list of common ingredients, as you will see these things are far from foodsafe
ALUMINA HYDRATE
ALUMINA OXIDE
ANTIMONY OXIDE
BALL CLAY
BARIUM CARBONATE
BENTONITE
BENTONITE - HPM-20
BONE ASH
BORAX
BORIC ACID
CADYCAL
CHROME OXIDE
COBALT CARBONATE
COBALT OXIDE
COPPER CARBONATE
COPPER OXIDE - BLACK
COPPER OXIDE - RED
CORNWALL STONE
CRYOLITE
CUSTER FELDSPAR
DOLOMITE
FLOURSPAR
FRIT 3110
FRIT 3124
G200 & NC4 FELDSPAR
GERSTLEY BORATE
IRON CHROMATE
IRON OXIDE - BLACK
IRON OXIDE 521 - RED
IRON OXIDE 4284 - RED
IRON OXIDE - YELLOW
LITHIUM CARBONATE
MAGNESIUM CARBONATE
MAGNESIUM SULFATE
MAGNESIUM ZIRCONIUM SILICATE
MAGNETITE
MANGANESE CARBONATE
MANGANESE DIOXIDE
MULLITE
NEPHELINE SYENITE
NICKEL CARBONATE
NICKEL OXIDE
OCHRE - YELLOW
POTASSIUM CARBONATE
PUMICE
PYROPHILITE
RUTILE - CERAMIC GRADE
SAND
SILICA - SAND & FLOUR
SILICONE CARBIDE
SODA ASH
SODIUM BICARBONATE
SODIUM SILICATE
SPODUMENE
STRONTIUM CARBONATE
SUPERPAX
TALC - NYTAL
TALC 2882 - PIONEER
TIN OXIDE
TITANIUM DIOXIDE
UMBER
VERMICULITE
WHITING
WOLLASTONITE
ZINC OXIDE
ZINC ZIRCONIUM SILICATE
ZIRCON "G" FINE MILLED
ZIRCOPAX PLUS

LATEX
MACALOID
WAX RESIST
PLASTILUBE
VANCIDE
VEEGUM
CMC POWDER
DARVAN

MAGIC MENDER
AZTEC HI-FIRE MENDER

spinycheek · Insert Custom Title Here

Whoa.....never letting terracotta get near my tank.

chris&barb · Lost

Nice list Steve

funkpolice · Reef-Geek

what is magic mender? is this what "the man" has been trying to "protect" us from for all these years? I'm gonna be pissed if I find out we've had magic at our disposal all this time.

high tide · Big-Geek

for humanitarian reasons they left out asbestos, from the list, not the clay. and yes they add it for strength, as much as I hate PDF files the msds sheets are just full of great reading lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris&barb

Nice list Steve

Quote:

Originally Posted by funkpolice

what is magic mender? is this what "the man" has been trying to "protect" us from for all these years? I'm gonna be pissed if I find out we've had magic at our disposal all this time.

Here's the list (and msds links) for "magic mender" its used for sticking handles on cups and repairs

ALUMINA HYDRATE ALUMINA OXIDE ANTIMONY OXIDE BALL CLAY BARIUM CARBONATE BENTONITE BENTONITE - HPM-20 BONE ASH BORAX BORIC ACID CADYCAL CHROME OXIDE COBALT CARBONATE COBALT OXIDE COPPER CARBONATE COPPER OXIDE - BLACK COPPER OXIDE - RED CORNWALL STONE CRYOLITE CUSTER FELDSPAR DOLOMITE FLOURSPAR FRIT 3110 FRIT 3124 G200 & NC4 FELDSPAR GERSTLEY BORATE IRON CHROMATE IRON OXIDE - BLACK IRON OXIDE 521 - RED IRON OXIDE 4284 - RED IRON OXIDE - YELLOW LITHIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM SULFATE MAGNESIUM ZIRCONIUM SILICATE MAGNETITE MANGANESE CARBONATE MANGANESE DIOXIDE MULLITE NEPHELINE SYENITE NICKEL CARBONATE NICKEL OXIDE OCHRE - YELLOW POTASSIUM CARBONATE PUMICE PYROPHILITE RUTILE - CERAMIC GRADE SAND SILICA - SAND & FLOUR SILICONE CARBIDE SODA ASH SODIUM BICARBONATE SODIUM SILICATE SPODUMENE STRONTIUM CARBONATE SUPERPAX TALC - NYTAL TALC 2882 - PIONEER TIN OXIDE TITANIUM DIOXIDE UMBER VERMICULITE WHITING WOLLASTONITE ZINC OXIDE ZINC ZIRCONIUM SILICATE ZIRCON "G" FINE MILLED ZIRCOPAX PLUS

Barbara · Geekette

Quote:

Originally Posted by high tide

If they are the normal terracotta pots just bare in mind they are probably the most produced item of all time, they put stuff in the mix thats hard to imagine and pronounce lol, its a low fired clay ie low heat, much of the additives are still open and somewhat soluble, here is a list of common ingredients, as you will see these things are far from foodsafe
ALUMINA HYDRATE
ALUMINA OXIDE
ANTIMONY OXIDE
BALL CLAY
BARIUM CARBONATE
BENTONITE
BENTONITE - HPM-20
BONE ASH
BORAX
BORIC ACID
CADYCAL
CHROME OXIDE
COBALT CARBONATE
COBALT OXIDE
COPPER CARBONATE
COPPER OXIDE - BLACK
COPPER OXIDE - RED
CORNWALL STONE
CRYOLITE
CUSTER FELDSPAR
DOLOMITE
FLOURSPAR
FRIT 3110
FRIT 3124
G200 & NC4 FELDSPAR
GERSTLEY BORATE
IRON CHROMATE
IRON OXIDE - BLACK
IRON OXIDE 521 - RED
IRON OXIDE 4284 - RED
IRON OXIDE - YELLOW
LITHIUM CARBONATE
MAGNESIUM CARBONATE
MAGNESIUM SULFATE
MAGNESIUM ZIRCONIUM SILICATE
MAGNETITE
MANGANESE CARBONATE
MANGANESE DIOXIDE
MULLITE
NEPHELINE SYENITE
NICKEL CARBONATE
NICKEL OXIDE
OCHRE - YELLOW
POTASSIUM CARBONATE
PUMICE
PYROPHILITE
RUTILE - CERAMIC GRADE
SAND
SILICA - SAND & FLOUR
SILICONE CARBIDE
SODA ASH
SODIUM BICARBONATE
SODIUM SILICATE
SPODUMENE
STRONTIUM CARBONATE
SUPERPAX
TALC - NYTAL
TALC 2882 - PIONEER
TIN OXIDE
TITANIUM DIOXIDE
UMBER
VERMICULITE
WHITING
WOLLASTONITE
ZINC OXIDE
ZINC ZIRCONIUM SILICATE
ZIRCON "G" FINE MILLED
ZIRCOPAX PLUS

LATEX
MACALOID
WAX RESIST
PLASTILUBE
VANCIDE
VEEGUM
CMC POWDER
DARVAN

MAGIC MENDER
AZTEC HI-FIRE MENDER

... keep away from clay pots!!!! Yikes!

Quote:

Originally Posted by funkpolice

what is magic mender? is this what "the man" has been trying to "protect" us from for all these years? I'm gonna be pissed if I find out we've had magic at our disposal all this time.

funkpolice · Reef-Geek

Quote:

Here's the list (and msds links) for "magic mender" its used for sticking handles on cups and repairs

ALUMINA HYDRATE ALUMINA OXIDE ANTIMONY OXIDE BALL CLAY BARIUM CARBONATE BENTONITE BENTONITE - HPM-20 BONE ASH BORAX BORIC ACID CADYCAL CHROME OXIDE COBALT CARBONATE COBALT OXIDE COPPER CARBONATE COPPER OXIDE - BLACK COPPER OXIDE - RED CORNWALL STONE CRYOLITE CUSTER FELDSPAR DOLOMITE FLOURSPAR FRIT 3110 FRIT 3124 G200 & NC4 FELDSPAR GERSTLEY BORATE IRON CHROMATE IRON OXIDE - BLACK IRON OXIDE 521 - RED IRON OXIDE 4284 - RED IRON OXIDE - YELLOW LITHIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM SULFATE MAGNESIUM ZIRCONIUM SILICATE MAGNETITE MANGANESE CARBONATE MANGANESE DIOXIDE MULLITE NEPHELINE SYENITE NICKEL CARBONATE NICKEL OXIDE OCHRE - YELLOW POTASSIUM CARBONATE PUMICE PYROPHILITE RUTILE - CERAMIC GRADE SAND SILICA - SAND & FLOUR SILICONE CARBIDE SODA ASH SODIUM BICARBONATE SODIUM SILICATE SPODUMENE STRONTIUM CARBONATE SUPERPAX TALC - NYTAL TALC 2882 - PIONEER TIN OXIDE TITANIUM DIOXIDE UMBER VERMICULITE WHITING WOLLASTONITE ZINC OXIDE ZINC ZIRCONIUM SILICATE ZIRCON "G" FINE MILLED ZIRCOPAX PLUS

that's an awfully complicated way to say eye of newt and pixy dust.

[1 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 02:48 PM	Reef-Geek
Clay Pots Question for everyone. Everyone please chime in if you have info that might help. Scenario: Broke a clay pot and put two pieces (one in each of my tanks with anemones near them) for my clowns to have a nice flat spot to lay their eggs. Problem: Both my LTA which has been doing well for over a year looks like ****... (there is a video of it going downhill yesterday) and my nice new carpet doesn't look much better. I took both pieces out and it looks like the LTA is already looking happy again. So... my question is what is in a clay pot that created this negative reaction in my anemones. I cant imagine copper, and i know there are silicates that are used to make the pots, could this create a problem? Any input will help! Thanks everyone ~Jared	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[2 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-29-2010, 03:34 PM	Lost
I would add some carbon also to remove anything else that may be causing this. Give me a sec to look at clay pots and what they are made from	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[3 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 03:46 PM	Reef-Geek
I'm pretty sure it was the clay because this happened to two separate anemones in two different tanks shortly after the clay pot was introduced in each tank. Thank you for looking into it for me	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[4 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-29-2010, 03:51 PM	Lost
Holly smokes! Clay is not easly defined "Clay is a naturally occurring material composed primarily of fine-grained minerals, which show plasticity through a variable range of water content, and which can be hardened when dried and/or fired. Clay deposits are mostly composed of clay minerals (phyllosilicate minerals), minerals which impart plasticity and harden when fired and/or dried, and variable amounts of water trapped in the mineral structure by polar attraction. Organic materials which do not impart plasticity may also be a part of clay deposits." From the sounds of this it could be pretty much anything.	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[5 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-29-2010, 03:51 PM	Lost
Holly smokes! Clay is not easly defined "Clay is a naturally occurring material composed primarily of fine-grained minerals, which show plasticity through a variable range of water content, and which can be hardened when dried and/or fired. Clay deposits are mostly composed of clay minerals (phyllosilicate minerals), minerals which impart plasticity and harden when fired and/or dried, and variable amounts of water trapped in the mineral structure by polar attraction. Organic materials which do not impart plasticity may also be a part of clay deposits." From the sounds of this it could be pretty much anything.	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[6 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 04:07 PM	Reef-Geek
Ya that's basically the definition that I found... and it didn't really say anything about what it is lol... Guess I got a bad clay pot? lol	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[7 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-29-2010, 05:26 PM	Lost
I guess you could have. Ive never been a fan of clay pots for clowns anyway but so many people use them. How long have the pots been out now and how are the nems looking?	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[8 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 05:40 PM	Reef-Geek
took both out yesterday and the anemones are decent at best... Hopefully all will improve b/c they are nice anemones, but I'm not too worried. They will bounce back LTA is already starting to lose the bad ends and disc is starting to fill back in nicely And momma is starting to eat again which means her home is doing better lol.	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[9 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-29-2010, 06:10 PM	Lost
Thats great they are doing better. I wish i could be more help but from what ive found clay could be pretty much anything	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[10 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 06:16 PM	Reef-Geek
No i understand, I wasn't able to find any more than you did... thats why I was so confused. Clay has a very... broad composition i guess lol	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[11 (permalink)] Posted by Barbara 01-29-2010, 06:20 PM	Geekette
while I don't know much more than what was already stated about clay...I do know to listen to my livestock! If both nems reacted negatively as soon as the clay was introduced in two different tanks...and they're both now doing good again since you took the clay out...I for one would NOT use clay in those tanks! what about adding a ceramic tile in each tank? we added a tile to our 30g with the saddles since we didn't really have a spot on the rocks for them and they took to it immediately with no negative impact on the carpet...just a thought! this is an interesting issue that you raised Jared....most people I know who use clay pots are using them in breeding tanks...tanks that do not include corals, inverts or anemones...I wonder if the clay is fine for fish but not for other livestock??? hmmmmmm...very interesting indeed	Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 11,831 Gameroom cash: $4003554 Rep Power: 100
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[12 (permalink)] Posted by spinycheek 01-29-2010, 06:46 PM	Insert Custom Title Here
I believe clay also has the ability to bind to (and potentially re-release) many types of heavy metals and toxins, hence why it's so popular for lining toxic waste dumps. You probably just a got a bad pot.	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Lakewood, CO Posts: 4,144 Gameroom cash: $1269517 Rep Power: 81
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[13 (permalink)] Posted by Jcling 01-29-2010, 06:57 PM	Reef-Geek
I'll have to try the ceramic tiles at some point I'm thinking the same thing about the clay pots but I'm a fan of keeping my clowns in as natural an environment as i can	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Pa half time and De the other half Posts: 634 Gameroom cash: $246065 Rep Power: 17
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[14 (permalink)] Posted by high tide 01-29-2010, 08:49 PM	Big-Geek
If they are the normal terracotta pots just bare in mind they are probably the most produced item of all time, they put stuff in the mix thats hard to imagine and pronounce lol, its a low fired clay ie low heat, much of the additives are still open and somewhat soluble, here is a list of common ingredients, as you will see these things are far from foodsafe ALUMINA HYDRATE ALUMINA OXIDE ANTIMONY OXIDE BALL CLAY BARIUM CARBONATE BENTONITE BENTONITE - HPM-20 BONE ASH BORAX BORIC ACID CADYCAL CHROME OXIDE COBALT CARBONATE COBALT OXIDE COPPER CARBONATE COPPER OXIDE - BLACK COPPER OXIDE - RED CORNWALL STONE CRYOLITE CUSTER FELDSPAR DOLOMITE FLOURSPAR FRIT 3110 FRIT 3124 G200 & NC4 FELDSPAR GERSTLEY BORATE IRON CHROMATE IRON OXIDE - BLACK IRON OXIDE 521 - RED IRON OXIDE 4284 - RED IRON OXIDE - YELLOW LITHIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM CARBONATE MAGNESIUM SULFATE MAGNESIUM ZIRCONIUM SILICATE MAGNETITE MANGANESE CARBONATE MANGANESE DIOXIDE MULLITE NEPHELINE SYENITE NICKEL CARBONATE NICKEL OXIDE OCHRE - YELLOW POTASSIUM CARBONATE PUMICE PYROPHILITE RUTILE - CERAMIC GRADE SAND SILICA - SAND & FLOUR SILICONE CARBIDE SODA ASH SODIUM BICARBONATE SODIUM SILICATE SPODUMENE STRONTIUM CARBONATE SUPERPAX TALC - NYTAL TALC 2882 - PIONEER TIN OXIDE TITANIUM DIOXIDE UMBER VERMICULITE WHITING WOLLASTONITE ZINC OXIDE ZINC ZIRCONIUM SILICATE ZIRCON "G" FINE MILLED ZIRCOPAX PLUS LATEX MACALOID WAX RESIST PLASTILUBE VANCIDE VEEGUM CMC POWDER DARVAN MAGIC MENDER AZTEC HI-FIRE MENDER	Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 5,338 Gameroom cash: $1517033 Rep Power: 89
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[15 (permalink)] Posted by spinycheek 01-29-2010, 10:12 PM	Insert Custom Title Here
Whoa.....never letting terracotta get near my tank.	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Lakewood, CO Posts: 4,144 Gameroom cash: $1269517 Rep Power: 81
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[16 (permalink)] Posted by chris&barb 01-30-2010, 08:28 AM	Lost
Nice list Steve	Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: De Posts: 12,158 Gameroom cash: $3466460 Rep Power: 100
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[17 (permalink)] Posted by funkpolice 01-30-2010, 09:59 AM	Reef-Geek
what is magic mender? is this what "the man" has been trying to "protect" us from for all these years? I'm gonna be pissed if I find out we've had magic at our disposal all this time.	Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 385 Gameroom cash: $107735 Rep Power: 21
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